Hello all.

To stop other threads from getting clogged with this discussion I would like to start a new thread where it all could focus.

It started with some guy asking for a GSC-based aimbot script. People posted scripts, mods deleted scripts etc.

Finally, I got the following arguments from everybody:

It is cheating:
- It is an aimbot, thus cheating [c1]
- It is portable to newer CoD's where a GSC injector could be used to create a cheat [c2]

It is not cheating:
- It is server-side, server admin already has all the power [n1]
- It is a script that could be ported from/to sentry gun scripts [n2]
- [c2] is invalid due to the GSC injector being the actual cheat used [n3]

Now, the discussion. [c1] can easily be seen as a result, not as an argument towards the "it is cheating" side. When a player abuses such a script, it is indeed annoying. It might be considered cheating.

But, other side:
[n1] states that it can only be used by the server admin. This is indeed true. As [c2] states however, in newer CoDs the server admin is a player, not the server owner (stupid IWNet).
This means people can use stuff like a gsc-injector [c2] to start their own custom scripts to give themselves all kinds of power. If it is used like this, the script is indeed used for cheating.
But isnt the use of a gsc-injector COMBINED with the aimbot script the actual cheating? And isnt the gsc-injector the worse cheat? (Im not that familiar with newer cods)


Im not trying to open a rant discussion. Just trying to get the facts covered about this subject.
[smalltext] Also, I disagree with the admins on this and would like to clarify these kind of issues once and for all[/smalltext]

Isnt the infinite ammo script that a lot of zombiemods use also a cheat? Infinite ammo is not possible with normal cod, and should, according to the beforementioned reasons (primarely the gsc-injector thingy) considered cheating.

Isnt a gsc that writes certain cvars to a player considered a cheat then too? Disabling effects (smoke is gone), showing players through walls can all be achieved by using gsc files.



This might all be true, but point is: In older cods only the server owner has the power to do this. In newer cods everybody COULD possibly abuse it due to a gsc-injector. Isnt every script considered a cheat then?

Shouldnt the whole modding games business be considered "cheating"?




Other side:
If people post gsc files that are easy to use, noobs (with possibly lower ethical standards) can possibly abuse those scripts, either by creating a server with them, or using a gsc injector.

Here I also stand my ground: The use of a gsc-injector should be considered a cheat.
Also, if this forum is not about helping noobs get scripts/knowledge about scripting, then what the hell is it for?

In my opinion, the aimbot-gsc file should not be considered a cheat, as it is useful for people to learn sentry gun behaviour (heck, i even used an aimbot gsc to test my theory on sentry gun AI), and scripting as a whole.
The abusing of scripts however should be considered cheating. But are we the ones that should decide what people can and cannot do?

[smalltext]me personally would even try to circumvent such limitations, just for the heck of circumventing them[/smalltext]

So, hoping to open a good discussion with good arguments from both sides, I end this post.

What the argument boils down to is the overall intention of the user.

In the case where all the discussion started, it was a clear cut asking for a cheat as that is the perceived intention from how the sentence(s) was(were) phrased.

below is from original request:

Temporally locking thread. Will be opened again in a few mins.

foyleman, Stryder and myself are currently discussing this. We should have a response soon. Thank you for your patience on this.

First of all I'd like to thank a couple of you for taking a mature attitude towards this issue.

I'd like to clear up the misinformation confusion that has occurred surrounding this topic. Let’s start at the beginning. Here is the original post that started this discussion made by csocsi96.


As we can see the poster is clearly stating that he is using a wallhack and is now asking how to create an aimbot to be used in conduction with the wall hack. This is a clearly a breach of our forum rules – link. These rules have been in place since this site was created in back in 2002. This post was deleted, the poster was warned and the topic was closed.

Next came a new topic and post from liltc64. This post was to clearly continue a conversation that was locked for a reason...


This public continuation of a topic that was purposefully locked is a violation of our rules – link. Our issue with this here is not that that he posted code that allows someone to create a simple auto turret mod, it is that it is a clear attempt to continue an argument that has been carried over from another topic.

At this point Styder requested that Welshy intervene due to his previous history with liltc64 as well as his separation from the debate. He did and removed the second offending post, stating that


Again I fully agree with the action taken. To show that this was not just the action of one admin's interpretation of events, this was dealt with by a different administrator.

What followed broke down into personal insults and attacks towards site staff members. This again is also a breach of our site rules and was/will be dealt with as per the forum rules. At this point liltc64 took it upon himself to again ignore administrator’s requests and continued to break our forum rules by again posting the following.


For these and other directly related infractions, liltc64 was forum banned. liltc64 received a temporary ban for one week for his continued breach of the forum rules that are shown above. He did not have has site privileges removed because of the content of the code that he posted. He did not have his posts removed because he posted code for an auto-turret. His account has been temporary suspended purely because despite being warned on multiple occasions he continued to ignore our forum rules.

I’d also like to clarify something that keeps being brought to my attention. Around a year ago I asked Stryder and Welshy to become full administrators of this site (they kind of already were) but I wanted to make it official. Welshy, Styder and I are in constant conversation about one thing or another - this includes the website, forum topics and our members. At no point do they act without my knowledge and I trust their judgment in these matters. I agree with the actions taken by my co-administrators, and also agree with Stryders statement in mattys thread :


To sum up. Creating a turret mod is fine. What this is not fine of this is posting hacks and cheats and this site will not assist anyone in creating them.